Chefwise with Shari Bayer (TCGP S3 E8)

AI Transcript: please excuse any typos

Announcer:
Jonathan Pogash is the cocktail guru, a mixologist and hospitality expert. Ah, see? You know big words. Dude, I'm the cocktail guru. Cheers. Jeffrey's his dad, a wine and spirits author, historian, and consultant.

Jeffrey:
Well, I do my homework.

Announcer:
With decades of experience, they're always looking for the next big thing. Join this father and son duo for a few laughs as they explore the hottest trends in hospitality with the service industry's leading trailblazers and tastemakers. Welcome to the Cocktail Guru Podcast.

Jonathan:
Well, Dad, this is this is our first recorded episode after the New Year. So I'm glad to see you. And I want to say Happy New Year.

Jeffrey:
Happy New Year, Jonathan. Thank you very much. It's our first recording since our live direct recordings in Los Angeles.

Jonathan:
In L.A. That's right. What did you? More specifically, Hollywood. Did you and mom stay up to watch the ball drop? Do you do that anymore? No.

Jeffrey:
No, we never do.

Jonathan:
Okay. Did you have dinner at 4.30 and then did you sit on the couch until about 7.30 and then go to sleep?

Jeffrey:
Well, that's what your mother did, but I stayed up a bit later than that until around 9 or 9.30, 10 o'clock, then I went to sleep.

Jonathan:
Well, as you know, we were, um, we did a family trip, uh, with Megan and the kids and my in-laws to Puerto Rico.

Jeffrey:
Uh, so that was lifestyle. We sure were. Yeah. You were jealous. You went to the proverbial desert Island.

Jonathan:
We did go to the proverbial desert Island. Uh, it was great. It was a lot of fun. And there were tons of fireworks past midnight because we were, our Airbnb was in this little neighborhood and it was just like, clack, clack, clack, clack all over the place. Um, it sounded like we were in the middle of a, a war zone. But it was a great time and you'll have to come with us to Puerto Rico next time.

Jeffrey:
I would love to. How are the piña coladas?

Jonathan:
Yeah, that's basically all I drank were piña coladas. And they use actually a couple of the places used one of our partners, Monin, you know, they use the Monin, like, pina colada mix, which is really delicious. Anyway, so we have a guest. Yes, we do. And you have a drink.

Jeffrey:
In honor of our guest, yes, it's nothing that directly relates to our guest, but I'm sure she enjoys this drink as much as I do. I decided to make myself a Manhattan today. Love Manhattans. Cheers, everyone. Cheers. And the reason, may I just say one more thing? The reason I did that is because I was reminiscing, and I was looking through some storage files of mine, looking for something relating to this podcast, which I did not find. But I did find something really interesting, and that's this bar menu from the old Oak Room bar at the Plaza Hotel. a place that I frequented quite often. And it reminded me of the event that we did in 2003. That was, you were a youngster at that point. This Jerry Thomas tribute, which we did in the Oak Room at the Plaza, both of which are closed now since 2011. That's right. So I'm glad I have this bit of nostalgia here to look at from time to time.

Jonathan:
That's good one. Let's bring our guest on, Dad. I would love to. She is one of the icons of the public relations industry. She founded Bayer Public Relations in 2003. We have known her for quite a while, and we see each other every once in a while at various industry activities. She also has a podcast of her own. She's host and producer of All in the Industry podcast, which I believe was started in 2014. That is, I mean, that is like an OG of podcasting right there. She's also the former president of the New York Women's Culinary Alliance. She is a member of Les Dames des Coffiers. She's a contributing writer for Fathom, Tasting Table, Thrillist. She originally started her career at one of many several places, Charlie Trotter's in Chicago. We'll talk a little bit about that. She does have a book out called Chef Wise Life Lessons from Leading Chefs Around the World. We are very thankful to have Sherry Bayer as our guest. Hello, Sherry.

Jeffrey:
Hello, Sherry. Thank you for joining us today. This is fantastic. I've been listening to your podcast, by the way.

Shari Bayer:
Thank you. Thank you for having me and thank you for listening. I hope you've been enjoying it.

Jeffrey:
I have been enjoying it very much.

Jonathan:
Sherry, we always ask our guests this question. If you were stranded on a desert island, what would be your desert island drink?

Shari Bayer:
My desert island drink. I might go with two, being what you just mentioned about a pina colada. I actually don't drink alcohol, however. So I would go with a virgin pina colada. And my second would be just coconut water from a coconut. Like it has to be from a coconut. Oh, yeah. Like I would take a whole tree perhaps, you know, on my desert island and have coconuts from coconut water or coconut water from coconuts.

Jeffrey:
A true tiki drink out of a coconut. Yes.

Shari Bayer:
Yes. But that I think those would be my two that I would I would hydrate on that.

Jonathan:
I like that. And I want to actually start with something you just mentioned, which I didn't know, that you don't drink alcohol. And in an industry where we are in the alcohol industry, was this a choice? Is it fairly new? Have you been sober for a while? And how does it relate to working in the industry? How does that work out?

Shari Bayer:
Yes. I stopped drinking 21 years ago, actually. And so it's been a while. And I used to drink. I used to enjoy alcohol a lot. But I just as a lifestyle change, decided to quit. And my life got better after. And I never thought about leaving the hospitality industry because I wasn't drinking alcohol. I never really talked about it that much. I feel like now it's more It's more common for people to be talking about zero proof drinks and lifestyle changes, and I'm comfortable talking about it. I feel. It really hasn't affected my role in the industry at all. And even for, I mean, I've known you for a really long time. I've seen you at tons of food and wine events where the alcohol is a part of the program. I just simply, my other third drink of choice, I would say, or probably my number one choice would be water. I usually walk around with water when I'm at these events. But it doesn't, I don't know, I still work with restaurants, chefs, bars, even alcohol brands, and it just hasn't made a difference because I'm just passionate about the hospitality industry and what I do. But yeah, but I don't really, I have not had a Manhattan in a long time, so.

Jeffrey:
I didn't know that, I'm sorry.

Shari Bayer:
No, don't be sorry. I mean, I'm sure it's delicious and I'm glad you're enjoying it. But that's the thing, too. Like, I don't want anyone ever not to drink because I'm not drinking alcohol. Like, that's the one thing that would like not make me happy if people were refraining from it just because I wasn't drinking. Like, I want everyone to do what they're comfortable doing and enjoying.

Jeffrey:
We've interviewed at least two, maybe three bartenders, people who are very much a part of the alcoholic beverage industry who do not drink. So this is not a new topic for us. As a matter of fact, we've devoted several episodes to that topic.

Shari Bayer:
That's good to know. And also I've noticed that someone who, I dine out quite often and work with a lot of restaurants, but now restaurants and bars are putting thoughtfully crafted non-alcoholic drinks in their cocktail programs, which is not something We saw, I don't think even like two years ago, like it's pretty new, but it's, it's pretty common now.

Jonathan:
Yeah. I don't know if you're noticing that. You have a lot of, um, you know, non-alcoholic spirits out there that sort of mimic the, the flavor, uh, of, of alcoholic beverages. So, you know, you don't have to have a Manhattan, you can have a faux Hatton. No, I don't know. I just made that up. But, you know, there are many of these non-alcoholic spirits brands. I found that many of them are really good and many of them are really bad. So, you know, you really have to, it runs the gamut. You really have to experiment. But it's kind of fun to have all of these new ingredients out there and to have menus that are devoted to non-alcoholic drinks, non-alcoholic cocktails at restaurants that you dine in.

Shari Bayer:
Yes, true.

Jeffrey:
Yeah, and that's maybe one of the reasons why you have become so philosophical, Sherry. I've noticed during your podcast, you always have words of wisdom, which I appreciate very much. You tell us to be our authentic selves, to tell authentic stories, to spread our expertise throughout the world instead of just keeping it all to ourselves. among the other words of wisdom that you have given us all. And all of that is compiled to some extent into your book, Chef Wise, because I'm sure the chefs that you interviewed have just as many philosophical ideas and adventures and wild topics to discuss as you have during your podcasts.

Shari Bayer:
Yes. For every show, I tip it off with a PR tip. And since I started in 2014, which is hard to believe, and I didn't realize or know, probably, that I was going to be doing so many episodes, or I didn't know where it was going to go. But I'm at 374 episodes at this point, and every show has a tip. And I try not to repeat. So I go in that direction of a little more lifestyle-type tips and not just straight. I think at the beginning, I had a tip like, have a great subject line or more specific to PR. But yeah, they're kind of lifestyle tips that I tie in. And yes, my book has a ton of advice from 117 chefs around the world. And there's no recipes in the book. It's a book really on advice. And I think it's an inspirational book for anyone, anyone. It doesn't have to necessarily be for people in the culinary or hospitality world, or it's certainly good, or I think would be a great book for young people thinking about getting into the industry and thinking about being a chef or restaurateur. But I think the advice in the book could apply to anyone in any career. So kind of like myself.

Jeffrey:
How could you get 117 chefs to be involved in this project. It's amazing.

Shari Bayer:
It was the goal was 100, and with my outreach I landed with 117. I mean, the reason the book came about or the reason I got this publishing opportunity with Phaidon to do a chef advice book was that I do have a lot of relationships with chefs. And I've traveled around the world and gone to many of the restaurants that are in the book, not to say all of them that I would like to go. That's all my mission to now go around the world and go to all the restaurants in my book of the chefs who are in the book. Yeah, no, it was I just did a lot of outreach and chefs were pretty eager to be a part of it. And I think they did have a lot to say and they were excited about contributing. So but that was like putting this book together. I think half of it, the first half was the outreach and getting the responses. And then the second half was making sense of it and putting it into a book form.

Jeffrey:
Chefs are notoriously hard to pin down, are they not?

Shari Bayer:
Well, I work with them, so I went in it knowing that.

Jonathan:
I think the general public in the last eight to 10 years has really been super interested in what, not that they weren't before, but especially now what chefs have to say and the chef's specific lifestyle and work habit, TV shows like The Bear and obviously Anthony Bourdain's influence, I think has grown that. Is there any advice that chefs have given that assist with, you know, understanding the lifestyle of a chef and understanding the mental, you know, capacity or lack of capacity that could happen working in a kitchen?

Shari Bayer:
Absolutely. There's 14 chapters in the book, and one of the chapters is work life balance, which I don't think if I was working on the book probably 10, 15 years ago, or maybe even back in my days at Charlie Trotter's in 1996 and 7, I don't know if that would have been a chapter we would be talking about. But I thought it was important to ask chefs about that and what that means. A lot of the chefs in the book are restaurateurs beyond being chefs, and maybe of multiple restaurants. They do talk about that and other chapters are on team, on business, on philosophy, on there's a cooking chapter, there's a PR or communications chapter, chapter on future, chapter on technology. So I tried to touch into all of the aspects of what it takes to be a chef beyond just cooking amazing food, which nowadays it is. It's like it's I mean, chefs have become these you know, rock stars in these have to, many have to, are expected to do PR or do social media and to like be out there as spokespeople beyond just being in the kitchen. So we tried to touch on, on all those topics. And I think there was one thing that I found, which was really nice with working on the book or comforting in a sense is that I was talking to chefs from Dubai to Copenhagen to to New York, to Singapore, all over the world. And there was a common thread sometimes in what they were saying about the importance of teamwork or what work-life balance means to them. And this is the book. I don't know if you've seen it. But this is my one special copy I have that I've been, I travel a lot and I've been going to awards events like the world's 50 best in Valencia. And I've been carrying this one around and getting the chefs to sign it. This is Massimo Battura. And I mean, it got a little messy in the front with people signing on, but I usually then I try to find their page in the book and get them to sign it. So we'll see. I think I have about 30 signatures at this point.

Jeffrey:
And thanks to your podcast, I now know you'll have the opportunity to do more of that chef searching in Las Vegas in June.

Shari Bayer:
Yes.

Jeffrey:
Yes. When that organization 50 World's Best has its award ceremony and reunion in the great city of Las Vegas.

Shari Bayer:
Yeah, it's a big thing. They're bringing it. Yeah, it's in June. It will be in Las Vegas. This last year was in Valencia. They pick spots around the world. And so I think it's going to be, I'm hoping, planning to go or hoping to go. And I think it will be really exciting.

Jeffrey:
Yeah. Well, after I heard your podcast, I thought that maybe I would go too. I would love to. I'm way overdue for a trip to Las Vegas.

Jonathan:
Yes, I could see that this was, you know, yeah. So I've worked in many restaurants since, you know, I was 16 years old. And, you know, working with chefs can oftentimes be challenging because there are different personality types with chefs, you know, and what I found is the ones that I learned from the most are the ones that are not jerks. Um, and you know, there are, there's definitely a lot of, um, stress, a lot of drama, you know, elevated voices, people fighting with each other in kitchens just because it's, it's a stressful job. Um, it really is. Uh, but have you found that there is kind of a, a sweet spot when it comes to a chef, their attitude, their attitude in the kitchen and how successful they are? Um,

Shari Bayer:
I'm not sure I understand the question. Like, are there drives?

Jeffrey:
Or, like, they have to be... They're personalities, I think. Yeah. What type of personality seems to be the most successful in the kitchen?

Shari Bayer:
I think people who are driven are successful and also are more likely to be. I think The thing about being a chef is that it's hard. It's a hard career to be a chef and restaurateur. And I don't think anyone in the book said it was easy. I think everyone gets into it because they're passionate about it. And it's kind of like what they have to do. Like, this is what I have to do. And this is where I want to be and the adrenaline of service and being in the kitchen and working with people and working with food and working with your hands. being in service. I mean, I think that all, it attracts, you know, I think certain people just, they have to do it. Like it's their passion, like what they need to do as far as a career. And that's why they do it because I think there's a lot of easier jobs or things that people could do or easier ways to make a paycheck too. You know, the margins are really tight with restaurants and it's a difficult industry, but I think it's passion that I would say drives people the most to do what they do and be successful. And as I mentioned before, it's like beyond cooking great food. I mean, all the other things now that you're kind of expected to do as a chef with, let's say, social media or just PR opportunities or just your team, you know, making sure your team is well taken care of. It's like it's your family and you spend so much time with this group of people that I think you have to really be passionate about it and committed. And the chefs in the book, I think, talked a lot about, you know, they were honest about Mistakes they've made, failures, and nothing. I don't think anyone was an overnight success. You know, I think it took a lot of time to get to where they are today from a Masumoto, or an Eric Ripert, or a Dominique Crenn, or Jeremy Okoye. And I mean, these chefs around the world, they're passionate, and they paid their dues as well. So I think they talk about that in the book.

Jonathan:
And so what about what about moving from, you know, working in a restaurant like Charlie Trotter's? You were saying that, you know, 1996, 97, and then continuing on and starting a public relations firm and also the time in between. What was that transition like?

Shari Bayer:
So my whole career has been kind of accidental in a sense, like I mean, talk about passion. I'm definitely passionate about what I do, and I've just always been attracted to the culinary industry and restaurants in particular. So after college, I went to University of Michigan. I moved to Chicago and I worked in restaurants. And on the high end, I was a server at Charlie Trotter's. And I went to cooking school when I lived in Chicago too. I did a six month program. I had moments where I thought I wanted to be a chef. And then I wasn't exactly sure still like my exact calling or like my, what was the perfect career for me. So I moved to New York in 1998. And then I dabbled in a few things like food styling and recipe testing. And then I ended up at a PR firm. This is going back to 2000, 2001, that mostly did restaurant PR and a lot of high profile accounts and openings in New York. Like we worked with Bobby Flay and taught English and Open Tao and Sushi Samba and all these. I kind of had this aha moment of like, oh, maybe this is what I can do with my career. So I learned PR from on the job. I never studied it. And I've just found that it was a great fit for me as someone who loved restaurants in the industry, but didn't necessarily know if I want to be the one cooking or managing or serving. So I started my own PR company in 2003, and I've been at it since. So I'm like 20 years, I can't believe I've been doing PR for restaurants, primarily in New York, and all different types of restaurants, you know, from more fast casual places to fine dining to family run to Like one of my current clients is Central Park Boathouse, which I'm excited about, and they're getting ready to open their restaurant.

Jonathan:
Right, well, that's very exciting because they closed and it was unsure of whether it was going to reopen, right?

Shari Bayer:
Yeah, well, there's a new ownership now and there's a lot of eyes on it because it is an iconic restaurant that's part of Central Park. But yeah, it's been a great account for me to be working on and working with the people. Legends Hospitality is managing it now. And yeah, I think the thing with PR is that there's a certain, I guess you say, formula, in a sense, of doing a new restaurant opening. And it's about media relations and communication and context. Every client I have is different and has their own story to tell. And that's, I think, what keeps me motivated or like it's never it's never the same. And and and it's exciting in that way. So I'm excited to be working with them.

Jeffrey:
Every day is different and new and exciting in the world of PR.

Shari Bayer:
True.

Jonathan:
Yeah, that's that's what dad was doing.

Jeffrey:
Well, my entire life, that's what I've been doing for the last 15 years.

Jonathan:
Oh, I didn't know that.

Jeffrey:
Yes, yes, yes. It's a long and sordid history. First, representing all the wine producers in the region of Alsace in northeastern France for 19 years or so, and then around 18 years with Scheflin and Somerset slash Moet Hennessy USA as their director of communications.

Shari Bayer:
Amazing.

Jeffrey:
Yep. That's dad. Dad's resume. We share that occupation somewhat.

Jonathan:
I love it. Yeah. And podcasting is a very interesting form of communication and art, I guess, media art. And really, my dad and I started doing it because, you know, during the pandemic, we didn't get to see each other. So we got to, you know, see each other. And also dad wanted to document personalities in the industry, um, and, you know, chefs and bartenders and, and PR folks and, and hospitality and, um, entertainment industry people. Uh, so that was our impetus, but your impetus for starting the, um, all in the industry podcast, what, how did that come about? And it was so early in podcasting. I feel like, I mean, I'm sure there were other podcasts at that time, but really the industry, the podcast industry has blown up.

Shari Bayer:
Yes, true. I came up with the idea for my show, I was at the 10-year mark with my PR company, and I was sort of thinking what else or what should I be doing now, not thinking I would stop doing PR. And I realized I just knew a lot of people in the industry from going to tons of events and working with different restaurants and and clients over the years. And they were people who did different things than what I did, whether they designed the restaurants or they did the cocktail programs or they did, you know, the technology or, you know, built websites for restaurants. And I sort of had this idea of like, oh, well, maybe I could do a show about them, behind the scenes talent and hospitality. and tell their story, because most people are telling the stories of the chefs or the restaurateurs or the front of the house people, the main people, but not the behind the scenes people. So that's kind of how it came about. And I didn't have any podcasting experience. I reached out to Heritage Radio Network about possibly joining their network with my podcast. And Heritage had actually been around for five years before I came in. But they weren't, you know, it was a little, I guess, looser in the way they were doing programming at the beginning. But our studio is still in the backyard of Roberta's in Bushwick, Brooklyn. And so I pitched them an idea for a show and I got a show after, you know, doing a couple of trials. I would go out every week, Wednesdays at four o'clock, to Bushwick in the backyard of Roberta's in our shipping containers and do interviews. And it was live. The pandemic changed the live aspect. We started doing more remote interviews like this using programs like Zencastr and talking to people through the computer. But when I first started or the first or are we like how many years, six years of the show, I was doing the show all live. So I don't really, I still record my shows like they're live, maybe some minor editing, but it's really more of a raw conversation with people. And I just keep going with it because I love talking to people and hearing their stories and finding out what they do and their stories inspiring other people. And there's just so many more people, even though I've done so many shows, I'm always like, oh, I need to have them on. Like, there's just, there's great people in our hospitality industry that do amazing things. So I just love doing it. So that's how it came about.

Jonathan:
That's great. And you are one of those great people in the hospitality industry, Sherry. And we've we've really, really enjoyed this conversation. I always wish that we could, you know, chat more with our guests. But thank you so very much for joining us on the Cocktail Guru podcast.

Jeffrey:
We'll probably need a part two.

Shari Bayer:
Thank you so much. I really appreciate it. And congratulations to both of you on on all of your success and putting this show together and that you, it's, I think it's a very cool dynamic you have as a son and father team and it's great. So I'm very, I feel very lucky to be a part of your show. So thank you for having me.

Jeffrey:
Oh, thanks. Thank you, Sharon. Thanks, cheers. We loved having you and speaking with you. So good luck, continued good luck. Same to you. Great success with the book too. Chef wise.

Shari Bayer:
Thank you.

Jeffrey:
Tipple Time is brought to you in part by Libertine Social and Sierto Tequila.

Jonathan:
All right, I'm so excited to be here with Mr. Tony Abhuganam at Libertine Social at Mandalay Bay Resort and Casino. Oh my gosh, Tony, what a space. Thank you so much, Jonathan. And you all may recognize Tony from the episode that he did for the Cocktail Guru podcast. And I brought him on for a very special Tipple Time episode segment here. We're going to do a little comparative tequila tasting and then make a drink.

SPEAKER_01:
Beautiful. Well, I've got the perfect vessel. This is the TAG Global Spirits Awards Universal Spirit Glass that we designed. That's a beautiful glass. Thank you.

Jonathan:
Well, let's test it out. Okay. So I'm going to give you the Sierto Extrañejo, and I'm going to pour a little bit of the, what am I pouring here? The Reposado.

SPEAKER_01:
Okay. You want to put about an ounce in this glass. Oh, see, I didn't put enough. Yeah. An ounce is about the perfect amount in this glass. OK. To be able to taste and evaluate, as well as to have enough for the two-sip method that I prefer. Oh, the two-sip method.

Jonathan:
Yes. So we've got the Repo on the right and the Extrañejo on the left here.

SPEAKER_01:
So let's start with that.

Jonathan:
So show me what to do here.

SPEAKER_01:
OK, with this glass, you want to get your nose in there. But these are 40% alcohol. What I recommend is you open your mouth and you try to breathe equally between your mouth and your nose. So we aerate the tequila over the olfactory. OK. And just tell me what you get.

Jonathan:
I get vanilla and spice.

SPEAKER_01:
That's coming from, I wonder how long in oak, because I get it.

Jonathan:
11 months. So yeah, so right on the top for a repple. Yes, 11 months in French oak. Oh yeah, so vanilla and oak, some dried fruit, like dried berries, cinnamon, baking spices.

SPEAKER_01:
All the baking spices. And I'm still getting your roasted agave. And that's the beauty of reposado, is you get those barrel notes, but you also get the agave. And this is well made. Exactly. Yeah, it is. All right. Now, what I like to do when we taste is, first sip, I just want to use as mouthwash. Do you swish? Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. And then we go back in.

Jonathan:
Oh, excuse me, but the Las Vegas weather is making my lips very, very dry. And it is a tad excruciating because it burns, but I'll push through.

SPEAKER_01:
But it's such a good burn. All right, now we go back in a second time. Take a little sip. Again, coat the palate. Realize how it feels on the palate, the viscosity, the mouthfeel. Then swallow. And then breathe in like you're doing yoga. Comes down into your chest like a hug on the inside. Ooh, yes. Mm, yummy. I'm going to go do a downward dog right now. All right. I want you to try something. Oh, OK. That was the Repo, right? Yes. OK, keep your glass of Repo. Hand me the bottle. How important is the glass in tasting and evaluating spirits? Well, I'm going to pour the same tequila in this rocks glass, and a little bit more in your Tag Global Spirits glass, and just nose the two of them. OK. And you tell me.

Jonathan:
So OK, this is your glass. I barely get anything in this.

SPEAKER_01:
It gets so muted, right? Yes. I did this experiment and they couldn't believe that it was the same spirit in both glasses. That's amazing. I don't know if I've ever done this experiment before, Tony. So if you're trying to sell me a spirit or we're trying to evaluate your spirit, you want it to show in the best possible light and starts with the proper glass. Yes, it does. It also helps if you have a beautiful tequila in that glass.

Jonathan:
It's absolutely true. We also have the extra in yahoo. I want to give this a little bit of a try. Yep. All right. So if we're doing your method, we're nosing and gathering the characteristics in our brain. OK. Wow. That's almost, those are some deeper. Those are some deeper. Dark chocolate. Deeper oak and kind of.

SPEAKER_01:
Yes, dark chocolate.

Jonathan:
Like tobacco.

SPEAKER_01:
Leather. A little bit of funk in there. A little bit of funk, yeah. Is this a valley agave? It smells like it.

Jonathan:
Well, we're going to put whatever. We're going to put what it is right below us. OK, let me give it a little taste.

SPEAKER_01:
Remember, you've got to rinse first.

Jonathan:
OK, I rinsed.

SPEAKER_01:
Now I will taste it. Now we go back in and taste.

Jonathan:
Oh, yeah. I mean, I could see myself out on the porch having a sip of this, smoking a cigar.

SPEAKER_01:
Absolutely. I think a cigar with this after dinner in lieu of maybe a brandy or a scotch. Oh, and the finish on it is just so long and luscious. It's really nice. Full body, full mouthfeel. And the beautiful thing is you still get the agave. Even in an externejo, the oak hasn't completely dominated the agave. Lovely. Would you use this in a cocktail? Absolutely. Well, maybe not the Extra in Yeho. Okay.

Jonathan:
I might, you know, I mean, if I was doing like this super uber luxury event or working at a luxury bar, I might do a cocktail using the Extra in Yeho and just charge a little bit more.

SPEAKER_01:
And I would agree with you Jonathan. I think you kind of have to identify the cocktail. For me, when I'm making a Paloma, I love to use a Reposado. When I'm making my Margarita, I love a Blanco. Something like this Extrañejo, I'm thinking tree fruits like apple or pear, maybe those flavors. But sure, I mean if I had your money, I'd burn mine. So go for the Extrañejo.

Jonathan:
I mean, you know, must be nice to have that. Cheers, Tony. Thanks for joining us at Tipple Time and the Cocktail Guru podcast. And we'll see you next time. Cheers. Cheers.

Jeffrey:
Tipple Time is brought to you in part by Libertine Social and Sierto Tequila.

Jonathan:
That does it for today's show.

Jeffrey:
If you enjoy what we do, please rate, review, and subscribe to the podcast.

Jonathan:
To watch or listen to today's episode, or to see the show notes, visit TheCocktailGuruPodcast.com. You can also follow us on Facebook, YouTube, X, Instagram, or TikTok.

Announcer:
The Cocktail Guru Podcast is produced by First Real Entertainment and can be seen on EatSdrinksTV.com, Spotify, and Zencastr, or heard on Apple, Google, Amazon, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. Travel arrangements provided in part by Zelle Travel.